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RTWildChild

Rpm Transmission Install

162 posts in this topic

Sounds like what mine did when clutch clearance wasn't right. Destroyed the trans.

Clutch clearance is to loose, but wait until its fubar'd before you check it. Its usually cheaper that way.

If it's not a master/slave cylinder issue, I will pull the trans at the same time I install the one piece drive shaft.

 

For a clutch clearance issue, what does this mean and what is/are the ways to fix this? Would I need to buy a different clutch?

 

Blue bur - is this what you were talking about with that video you provided earlier for the TOB?

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It means when you push down the clutch pedal the TB doesn't travel deep enough in to the clutch to fully disengage.  On mine driving around on the street it was fine but at higher RPM my theory is that the discs expand just that 1000th of an inch to cause issues releasing it. 

 

Solutions - shim behind TB.  In my case the clutch was literally 1/2" too short so I had to get a new clutch and a trans rebuild.

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May be other symptoms if clutch not releasing properly like very low clutch pedal engagement or wheels spinning when off the ground and clutch in. Mine had these symptoms and rst clutch was not fully releasing resulting in very notchy shifting. Not sure if it was the cause of clutch failure, but release bearing was not shimmed to proper specs.  The new rxt clutch needed a .5" shim behind the release bearing for proper clearance.

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It means also, as plain as I can describe, your new clutch and pressure plate package is a smaller overall thickness when stacked ontop the flywheel. So your original TOB and slave have to use up valuable travel before they even make contact on the pressure plate fingers to release the clutch. So what seems like a trans, syncro, clutch, clutch pedal, tob,slave cylinder or master cylinder problems is nothing more than a spacing problem between the TOB and PP. The fix is a spacer you sandwich between your TOB and the face of the transmission. It may need to be .500 or .247 or .194 etc., but you just wont know until you measure by following the steps in that video.

http://i626.photobucket.com/albums/tt347/bdhmbre/IMAG0238_zpsoec2zfkl.jpg

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I would have thought if it was a shim issue, it would have been happening from the very beginning after the install to where it would have been immediately noticed whenever I would race.

 

I will have to troubleshoot all of this and will go through a check list.

 

Hopefully I caught this in time and is nothing to serious or big which will cause me to have to pay for another trans or clutch.

 

Really appreciate yalls time and info. Thank you.

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Step 1 for troubleshooting this issue:

58cb21ab203190df63048d690f82bed6.jpg

 

If this resolves the issue, which I strongly believe it should, I will say that I stand corrected and should listened to Speedy during the initial install of the transmission and replaced the Throw Out bearing which includes the slave cylinder that sits inside the bell housing/ transmission.

 

I will also be flushing the system with new Royal Purple Transmission fluid. Fingers crossed that it's a hydraulic issue and nothing more serious.

 

The severity of things will be uncovered when I pull the transmission again here soon once the nitrous install is completed in next 1-2 weekends.

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Finally got around to trying to troubleshoot this notchy shifting with the transmission. Unfortunately, still running into the same issues. TOB and clutch clearance were good and replaced the throw out bearing. Although TOB and clutch clearance were good, still thinking I should have put a shin just to make sure it has maybe extra clearance. Some instances the shifts are smooth as butter, other instances they are super notchy or require some force to put in gear. When I feel like I'm pulling/putting to much force to place into gear I put back into neutral, release the clutch and engage clutch again and will help engage the gear (sometimes very smooth or notchy shift will occur).

 

 

Any other recommendations? Is the stock TOB ok, or is there a aftermarket that I could look into? Shifter position? Is it possible the clutch/pressure plate is fubar?

 

5ade5b721066d9364bee500c6dc7b9d5.jpgc4159f5462387fcc52d96ecf9d0b386e.jpg62d6b4c83e4aac5ebe09101e9afa189e.jpgcd4b14523e54ce1244e7ff716d3775b8.jpg89fed711616aa1b664278368801853a3.jpg

 

On a good note, was also able to install the DSS one piece aluminum driveshaft this weekend, HUGE night and day difference in the power it's putting down

30583bb6e9a75a132cf51c48b7aba934.jpg

31770c0d233f0a160752e460eb084da5.jpg

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How much air gap did you have between the throw out bearing and the pressure plate ? Which clutch are you running ? I wouldn't put a shim behind the TOB unless you have verified the air gap is to much, don't want the TOB constantly running against the pressure plate.

Did you slide the clutch disc on the spline and make sure there is no binding ?

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Just for grins take a look at your pilot bearing when I pulled mine out the Bering looked fine but when I pulled the race out I noticed that it the bearing at spun in the race an gauled the end of the input shaft a little bit

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Also, cross check the shift linkage to the shift handle in the car for good measure and make sure it's not making contact with anything like a DS loop or DS itself, especially if using aftermarket DS or shifter.

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I had another mechanic in the area take a look and take the car for a spin so he could feel what I was feeling with the notchy shifts and pretty much being locked out of a gear when down shifting. What is weird is that when attempting to down shift from 4th to 3rd-2nd or 1st, I would have a locked out feeling (notchy/not full engagement in some cases), I could rev up the engine while still having slight pressure to put into 1st, 2nd or 3rd and gear will engage/shift like butter, the way I know it to be when I first installed the RPM transmission.

 

Anyways, mechanic also has the opinion (same as others I've spoken to) that the clutch is bad. So it looks like I will now be going/purchasing a SS Spec Clutch kit (w/ flywheel). Just sucks, clutches are pretty damn expensive and figured the McLeod would hold up with my small HP. Barely installed the damn thing in April 2015.

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REALLY doubt it was the clutches fault.

Oh definitely, not gonna say I haven't put any punishment/racing miles to it nor did I say it was the clutches fault.

 

Just thought a McLeod would hold up a little better. Anytime I've taken the trans down, I've had a mechanic that works on city fleet vehicles and sports cars by night by my side with the assistance to make sure it was installed correctly.

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Did it always do this, or just start doing it?  Are you sure there is no air in the system and that the TOB is good?  I've beat on my McLeod pretty good and it's been flawless.  I did have a lot of frustration when I had the wrong height clutch originally.

 

Everyone, I think, who has had a Spec has removed it.  Few were happy and Mani tore one up and they refused to help him.

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I'll have to second what Speedy stated about the spec clutch, everyone I have seen in a challenger has been taken back out. My son had one in his 08 mustang and it was junk from day one, took it out after 4 months.

 

I know I ask this question before but what was the actual air gap measurement between the TOB & pressure plate ? The problem sounds like to much air gap.

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Did it always do this, or just start doing it? Are you sure there is no air in the system and that the TOB is good? I've beat on my McLeod pretty good and it's been flawless. I did have a lot of frustration when I had the wrong height clutch originally.

 

Everyone, I think, who has had a Spec has removed it. Few were happy and Mani tore one up and they refused to help him.

Compared it with the same P/N that you had gotten the second time around. It started doing it right after the recent Lonestar Moparfest, two months after the VII RPM transmission install. When I recently pulled the trans down thinking it was hydraulic, I put in a new factory TOB. Then pumped the clutch a few couple 100x. The shop I purchased the clutch through was kind enough to call McLeod to see if there was anything they would do and they said I was out of the 90 day warranty and out of their hands. (clutch hadn't been installed until way after 90 days of purchase; not that it doesn't matter cause I still drove it without problems way after 90 days of install) Little skeptical on sending it for repairs at a cost.

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I'll have to second what Speedy stated about the spec clutch, everyone I have seen in a challenger has been taken back out. My son had one in his 08 mustang and it was junk from day one, took it out after 4 months.

 

I know I ask this question before but what was the actual air gap measurement between the TOB & pressure plate ? The problem sounds like to much air gap.

Thanks for the feedback on the spec. I'll be sure to do some additional research on other clutches as well. Still debating on which route I will go and want to continue troubleshooting because some of me is in denial that the McLeod is shot. BUT based on the feedback from various mechanics and shops I've called to describe the issues, fingers are pointed to it. So I'm preparing for the worst. In regards to the air gap, I can't remember off the top of my head. Sorry, I completely overlooked your previous question.

 

I have the same set up as Speedy does with the clutch and transmission; besides the Fidanza. Can't remember if he said if he did or didn't put shims as well for the second McLeod clutch he put in. I would think it would be the same measurements.

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I will also throw my hatred of the Spec clutch in to the pot. I hated it from day one. after about a year sent it back to them for a refresh, and it was no better. I like the Centerforce now a bunch better. Funny that when I spoke to RPM and told them I had a CF he told me that would be his last recommendation, that they had had issues with them. I'm kinda wondering if since CF is much bigger with GM and RPM does mostly GM if that combination soured his thinking. He did recommend a 1/8 shim for the Centerforce clutch. We had a little drag after a couple months, but I went out and pumped it another couple hundred times and it went away. 

 

I always stress that when you think you've pumped the pedal enough, you need to go a hundred more times (at least)!

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Rt wildchild , by any chance did they give you a spacer to add a 1/2 or 3/4 inch to your throw out bearing for full engagement..

My first one lasted 1500 miles or so before it started going in to gear hard..sent the clutch to arrington, after some time it came back in a box with a spacer but no paper work.. Bought a new one, put it in with the spacer and 2000 or so miles same thing..arrington put the first one in with the new motor and a Chrysler tech did the second one.. That's all I got. Good luck, hope you get it sorted out and great job with the n20!!

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@BayouTiger - Thank you for the information.

 

@Mark 426 - No spacers came in the McLeod clutch box that was shipped to me. & thank you, finally nice to be done with the system. Now just to sort out this matter.

 

 

Side note: I truly appreciate the feedback and comments on what else I should be looking at/thoughts on the matter.

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Don't mean to harp but almost willing to bet money you have to big of an air gap between the TOB & pressure plate. Especially since you are using one aftermarket brand flywheel and another brand manufactures clutch. Find out what Mcleod recommends for the air gap and shim as necessary.

 

Here's a quick video on how to do it properly, there are many more that I've seen but this was the first one I pulled up.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7S746x3o3Q

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