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Speedy

Impacted by SC bearing issue

50 posts in this topic

So the new Hellcat has 1970 miles on it.  This past weekend I started hearing the supercharger getting louder.  There's a well known issue with some cars being affected by bad bearings in the supercharger and dealers replace them when impacted.

Swung by my local dealer this morning and they confirmed mine's affected.  New supercharger will be ordered and installed.

Now you see why I'm not jumping on pulleys and tunes right off the bat.  Supercharger is $10,000 (down from $18,000 last year) so that would have really hit the pocket book if I had to cover it.

I looked through the parts and the supercharger has changed P/Ns 4-5 times in the two years.  I also had a very good source tell me Dodge has completely changed the manufacturer of the bearings altogether due to issues.  Will probably get swapped out next week.  The tech doing the work is supposed to be pretty good, he works on all their SRT stuff and I saw him working on a new Viper a couple weeks back.  He just took delivery of a Go Mango T/A Challenger as well so there's that :)  I have a good relationship with the place and they've been a sponsor of CF so hopefully all nice and smooth.  I may even see if I can hang out and help do the swap.

On a related note, a buddy of mine and I had a little bit of a race leaving a cruise Saturday night.  He's a Corvette fan, and kinda one of those that thinks Corvettes are God's gift to the automotive industry.  He has a white 2016 Z06.  I think it's all stock except for an X pipe. 

First hit we were lining up and I had it in 4th instead of 3rd and we hit it at 60MPH and he pulled about a half a car on me until my RPMs recovered and we stayed in that same position up until I let off at about 140.  He kept on going to like 170 but that's too much for me around here.  Second hit I was behind him and better prepared in 3rd and when I heard his exhaust open up I mashed it to the floor and stayed right with him again until I let off at 150.  He kept going till 170+.  We both agreed nothing official so we need to get out somewhere really desolate and do a 40 - 140 and see what's what but I honestly expected him to pull on me a bit due to the lighter weight.  I weighed the Challenger and without me in it 4500lbs.  He weighed his Z06 and WITH him in it 3700.  Just shows the Hellcat really makes some steam, more than 707 for sure.

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Jay, sorry to hear about the SC.  Hopefully you'll be taken care of. :)

 

So, now that you've put almost 2000 miles.  How do you feel about the Orange Krush to Go Man Go swap?  Still happy with your decision?

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The Hellcat is night and day vs the old car.  The materials are much higher quality, the build quality is much higher, things like that.  You can tell the platform has progressed a lot in the past 8 years and that when the 2009s came out Dodge wasn't sure how well they'd do and went on the cheap side with a lot of items.  Still great cars, don't get me wrong, but nothing like the newer ones where some obvious money has been spent on the soft touch things, technology, fit, finish, etc.

The A8 is just viscous as well.  I do NOT miss the 6 speed whatsoever.  Being able to quickly grab a paddle and down shift 2-3 gears getting ready for a hard run and just smashing the throttle and letting the car shift is awesome, and the sense of acceleration never lets up.  The front end comes up and just stays there pinning you to the seat.  The gear shift are hard, fast, and crisp.

The big difference for me is I built Orange Krush and designed it to be what it is.  This car is just a stock car, so it's taking me a bit longer to bond with it.  I'm very happy with the Hellcat and think we'll have a lot of fun together, but I likely won't have the same emotional feelings about it I did with Orange Krush.  We'll see after it does some work for me at the drag strip.  Orange Krush had over 100 passes on it and exceeded everything I expected it to do.  Time will tell on the Hellcat if I end up feeling the same.  If I can get it to run in the 10.70 range with just some good tires and a drive shaft that'll go a long way but that's gonna be asking a lot I think.

I don't expect any issues with the SC replacement.  Local dealer and I have a long relationship and they're the ones who did the 5 year inspection on Orange Krush to keep the lifetime powertrain warranty even though it was heavily modified.  They even let me shoot a little funny youtube video of that inspection.  Good bunch of guys over there in the service department and the guy that'll do the work has 21 years of experience and is meticulous.

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Couldn't agree more with you Speedy. My Scat Pack is far better than the Challenger and your right I don't miss the 6 speed, especially in traffic.


Sent via Tapatalk
 

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Well unfortunately J, I think I'm in the same boat on the supercharger. Mine just turned over 2000 miles, I started noticing the noise a couple hundred miles ago. I'm going to take it in next week and let the dealer check it out.

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On Saturday, July 01, 2017 at 11:20 PM, ChargerRob said:

Mine is too, nearly 10k miles, couple hundred pass, upper and lower pulleys, I'm thinking  of replacing it with the 4.5l Whipple.

I don't think anyone has gotten a 4.5 whipple to run correctly yet on a Hellcat 

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4.5L Whipple would be a waste for a street car anyway, too much power to run it and you'd have to lock the bypass open on the street meaning no boost and slower.

I checked out the new Magnuson 2650 at the HRPT and it looks pretty interesting.  The guys there claimed they've made 1000RWHP with it and ran low 9s on their test car.

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10 minutes ago, Blown7 said:

I don't think anyone has gotten a 4.5 whipple to run correctly yet on a Hellcat 

There was a white Charger at the Mile in Texas with the 4.5. Running pretty damn good. Ran 211.5. Built by Peitz.

 

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On 7/4/2017 at 9:26 AM, Speedy said:

4.5L Whipple would be a waste for a street car anyway, too much power to run it and you'd have to lock the bypass open on the street meaning no boost and slower.

I checked out the new Magnuson 2650 at the HRPT and it looks pretty interesting.  The guys there claimed they've made 1000RWHP with it and ran low 9s on their test car.

...

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39 minutes ago, ChargerRob said:

Right now I'm around 850 rwhp so the 4.5l whipple to me wouldn't be much different.

You're missing the point I'm trying to make.  The 4.5L Whipple will take too much horsepower just to turn the blower.  The bypass will have to be locked open on the street because it will make too much boost with the biggest pulley that will fit, at least this will be the case if it's anything like the big Kenny Bell blowers people have run.  So on the street you'll have less power and no boost.  

Bigger ain't better with superchargers on street cars.  Now if you're just gonna go WOT at the track or Mile racing it'll definitely make more power there, but that's the only time it'll benefit.

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So dedicated race car or street car too?

You better do a lot of research before deciding on something that big.  Lots of down sides for something you wanna drive on the street if that's the case.

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Not to derail the 4.5 whipple discussion...

Thanks, Jay, for the Orange Krush to Go Man Go description, that's exactly what I was looking for. Honestly pushing me more towards a HC vice upgrading my RT. I did watch your powertrain video, that was some good stuff. :-)

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

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On ‎7‎/‎5‎/‎2017 at 7:04 PM, Speedy said:

So dedicated race car or street car too?

You better do a lot of research before deciding on something that big.  Lots of down sides for something you wanna drive on the street if that's the case.

I think you may want to discuss this with AJ or Josh, pretty sure they have a couple on the street with no issues.

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On 7/16/2017 at 11:52 AM, El Diablo said:

I think you may want to discuss this with AJ or Josh, pretty sure they have a couple on the street with no issues.

Always a behind the scenes story and a "couple" is probably about right ;)

You remember Karl had to have his bypass locked open on his big KB.  He told us about it at the TX Mile.  No boost on the street at all.  

Dude here with the Green car and the 4.0L Whipple had to put a pulley on there so big they had to build a pocket in his hood for it to fit.

Hellcat 2.4L blower

Demon 2.7L blower

Cobra Jet uses a 2.9L Whipple.

Copo Camaro uses a 2.9L Whipple.

Drag Pak Challenger (SC Version) 2.9L Whipple

There's a pattern, and it ain't bigger is better.

 

But back on topic, got my SC swapped out today to the new P/N 68271244AG.  Quiet as a mouse.  We'll see how it does over time.  I wasn't overly concerned about the noise on the original, but SRT has stated this P/N was specifically developed to solve the problem so I figured I'd get it changed out to be current.  Took the tech right at 2 hours.  Did a fantastic job even for my OCD standards.  Couldn't even tell any work had been done when I went back to talk to them wrapping up.

 

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On ‎7‎/‎19‎/‎2017 at 4:03 PM, Speedy said:

Always a behind the scenes story and a "couple" is probably about right ;)

You remember Karl had to have his bypass locked open on his big KB.  He told us about it at the TX Mile.  No boost on the street at all.  

Dude here with the Green car and the 4.0L Whipple had to put a pulley on there so big they had to build a pocket in his hood for it to fit.

Hellcat 2.4L blower

Demon 2.7L blower

Cobra Jet uses a 2.9L Whipple.

Copo Camaro uses a 2.9L Whipple.

Drag Pak Challenger (SC Version) 2.9L Whipple

There's a pattern, and it ain't bigger is better.

 

But back on topic, got my SC swapped out today to the new P/N 68271244AG.  Quiet as a mouse.  We'll see how it does over time.  I wasn't overly concerned about the noise on the original, but SRT has stated this P/N was specifically developed to solve the problem so I figured I'd get it changed out to be current.  Took the tech right at 2 hours.  Did a fantastic job even for my OCD standards.  Couldn't even tell any work had been done when I went back to talk to them wrapping up.

 

Drag Pack, Copo and Cobra Jet are limited to 2.9L blower by NHRA. If you gave them an option of a bigger blower, I'm sure they would take it.

 

Hellcat is a whole different world when it comes to transitions into boost then the older mechanical stuf. ITs easy to tailor the curve to make them drivable if you know what you are doing. I do agree that at some point, more power becomes useless on the street though....

 

J

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Good info on the NHRA regs.  

I think folks just seem to forget that these real big superchargers produce a lot of boost with big pulleys installed and take a lot of horsepower to turn them (parasitic loss) and just get hung up in hey I have a 4.5L blower on the car.  The right thing to do is set a goal for power, ET, Mile MPH, etc, and then do what's needed to achieve that goal with a bit of overhead built in.  That little 2.3L Maggie on my old car got me in the 10s at nearly 130MPH.  It was maxed out, but that's doing pretty good.  Hellcat's with a couple tweaks are running in the 9s with the stock 2.4L blower at about 140MPH, that's hauling ass.

It's been a while, but I think Karl's 4.2L or 4.5L KB made something like 19psi on the biggest pulley he could fit on there, had to notch the hood for it to fit, and had to lock the bypass open on the street because it was too much boost for pump gas even with the big pulley.

If all those issues are solvable today, then disregard.

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Too bad on your supercharger.....but just like my long block they are taking care of you . GREAT having performance backed with the warranty . Set of Drag radials and 10.7 isn't a problem at all for a stock cat :) 

Even though it kills me to agree with Fireball......Mike drives his 4.5 Whipple everyday. The car has over 20k miles on it. It ran 9.62 off the trailer . DTP / Brent has got them down !!!

Time will tell how long it lasts but right now its a bad mofo.

I do agree the "bigger not better " stance.....we were running my 2.8 to 20lbs ; it was maxed out but the car was consistant 9.8-10.2 depending on weather. NOONE I can recall could get the 3.6 to work due to the massive torque it pushes. Most just gave up on it and moved on. KB is supposed to be putting a 4.7 together for Cats.....time will tell on that too.

IT WONT BE ME !!! lol I'm happy as I can be with the Cat . I've done just the upper pulley , Driveshaft and a 3:09 gear change.....10.3 all day long. Just got skinnies I haven't ran yet so I'll see if the might give me a tenth .

 

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Which DS did you go with?  That's next on my list.  I just did the rear diff brace today.  I was thinking of a DSS 4" AL but several folks have said they cause vibrations?

 

I have no doubt the 4.5L Whipple on that guy's car runs fast at the track, WOT is where it would shine.  I'd just be curious how much boost he gets on the street for pump gas, that's a whole different ball game.

 

Karl's car would run over 200MPH at the Mile with his big KB, but like I said, ZERO boost on the street with the locked open bypass.  Kinda useless if you ask me.

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I wouldn't want the huge blower on the street either, but don't know that I would base much on Karl's KB. Whipple seems to have their bypass sorted much better than KB. From everyone I've talked to with the 2.9, they seem to be very happy with their manners on the street. Compare that to the WOT box and other solutions that had to be developed to tame the light switch that the 2.8 KB (and my Techco) were. Then again, tuning has come a log way in the last few years. 

It just seems to me that if you want to turn your H/C into an 8sec track beast, it makes more sense to get a 5.7 or 6.4 and build from there. what's the point of getting a $70K car with a warranty and voiding. I know there's a lot of tech in the H/C, but not sure how well it is going to work once you';ve done everything in your power to piss off Hal. 

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1 hour ago, BayouTiger said:

It just seems to me that if you want to turn your H/C into an 8sec track beast, it makes more sense to get a 5.7 or 6.4 and build from there. what's the point of getting a $70K car with a warranty and voiding. I know there's a lot of tech in the H/C, but not sure how well it is going to work once you';ve done everything in your power to piss off Hal. 

lol Chuck, I totally agree.  A pulley change and a tune and the HC is gonna be faster than 90% of the cars you come across at your typical track.  Bone stock they're faster than 75% already.  

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